I’ve gotten several queries today about more books in this and that universe, and for Foreigner, the answer is good.
One thing that has been so, so difficult is the number of times I have had to create a universe for some reason, then find that the publisher has been gobbled up by some oil company or the like, and they have now replaced my editor with someone who comes in with a different set of objectives…a view of how they want their line to work, and by definition, that’s got to be different than the guy they just fired. A lot different. Meaning holdovers don’t get support. They want something new-new-new, and what have you done different from the ‘old’ stuff.
It just kind of gnaws the heart out of a writer after a while. I’ve been really lucky with DAW: they back me, and have for a long, long time. But the story on many universes is—I can’t continue them because I can’t sell them in any viable way, because they have ‘history’ with another publisher.
This is why we’re working so hard on Closed Circle. Each of the three of us has a different history with the publishing mess, but all three of us are suffering from slow erosion of the sheer will to keep going and keep creating—because of the number of things we were once so excited about doing that have just gotten swept aside, not even in the market, but in in-house politics, between editors that want to ‘define’ themselves and some houses totally shifting direction.
So yes, the answer is—the more Closed Circle succeeds, the more I can do. I’m going to dive into the next Foreigner book right now, because that, and two more, are under contract. So that has to be my next. But do that next book in another series—oh, yes. I’d love to. I’ve just gotten wary of scattering any more pieces of me into the wind. So if we three can make a go of this—all sorts of possibilities open up for all those universes we all want to continue to explore.
@Brent and @CJ; I just Love the idea of an Atevi cookbook. It would be marvellous for CC and be lots of fun. Green Pizza, and that drink that Ilisidi serves come immediatley to mind. I imagine you might have to run it past Daw since they are publishing the Foreigner universe.
Well, heck, we can do it here.
Bren’s orange drink, for instance.
Vodka (made from grain), mixed with juice of orangelle—a native plant that has a flavor reminiscent of orange. Read: screwdriver, with a slightly alien flavor, which I imagine as a bit cucumberish.
I suggest calling it a Brendriver – perfect for taking the edge off a rough day. How about it?
Just make sure you grab one of the orange ones, and not one of the white ones…
Oh, and another thought… I’ve been reading about how authors (with long series) have greatly increased their sales, by making the 1st book of a series available as a free e-book.
I just ended up spending quite a lot of money buying e-copies of a number of the Darkover novels, because I chanced on a free one a couple weeks ago.
Of course, that trick only works if your books are good enough people can’t stop with just one… but, for you, that’s a given! 🙂
[and, I meant to say in my previous message, that if you had the Morgaine books, or the Faded Sun books, available on Closed Circle, I’d buy them again to reread, and I think other people would also]
Can’t do Morgaine or the Faded Sun: DAW still has them in print. But we are offering some free books over there, and more books are scheduled. Go to the store. I improved the navigation tonight, so you can find the freebies page—I hope!
Sort of a side comment but what the heck. Did anyone else watch “Doctor Horrible’s Sing Along Blog”? It’s (was?) an online movie/series/short-story thing that Joss Whedon did during the writer’s strike. From the wiki entry: Whedon funded the project himself (at just over $200,000[10]) and enjoyed the independence of acting as his own studio. “Freedom is glorious,” he comments. “And the fact is, I’ve had very good relationships with studios, and I’ve worked with a lot of smart executives. But there is a difference when you can just go ahead and do something.”
So it’s not just writers who feel hemmed in. And it’s a pretty good show… campy, and yet there some unexpected depths as well.
I respect Josh Whedon. And I understand. I believe CC’s budget is, well, about 50 dollars. But then—we don’t have to pay for lights, camera, and cameraman. The ‘go ahead and do something’ part—priceless. Ain’t the internet wonderful?
Ms. Cherryh wrote:
😆 Thank you. You guys who do scriptwriting are amazing. I did one movie project which turned into a Mack Sennett comedy, and I don’t mean it made the screen—and I so appreciate the nerves of steel it takes to do screenwriting—not to mention the skill it takes to do that backstory job. Any writer who’s ever just tried to do necessary reprise for a continuing series can appreciate the problem—but screenwriters have to do it AND do it fast.
Thanks for the compliment, although I prefer my compliments in rectangular form with “Pay To the Order Of” printed on them.
The problem with screenwriting is that writers write so they think in terms of dialog. Movies are a visual medium and you can eliminate literally pages of dialog with one shot. I once killed 3 pages of dialog that way and advanced the story in a superior way. Believe it or not watching silents is perhaps the best tutorial on screenwriting.
But I have a sort of advantage in that I was a crew guy-sound mixer-as well as writer so I was used to seeing the process. Most writers not only haven’t been on set, they’re actively barred. But that’s another story.
Phil Brown
I’ll bet there are stories. Knowing one writer personally who, when allowed access to the cover artist, had a meltdown over the color of a tiny trim used on a uniform collar—I can appreciate the potential disaster. [Sometimes it’s an item significant to the plot—but in this case, not.] Which is why publishing companies generally don’t put artists and writers in contact: it’s for the protection of the cover artists. I’m an exception, having a brother who can give me the phone number of most any artist they give me—but I do so try not to have meltdowns.
What you say re silent film, interesting. I bet it would help. Handling time in any sort of writing takes ingenuity: occasionally I have reminded a novice writer, hey, you drew the map; so move the mountain.
Books and film really are two very different animals, each with peculiar advantages and disadvantages.
Ms. Cherryh and I continue our conversation:
Books and film really are two very different animals, each with peculiar advantages and disadvantages.
Here’s an illustration. In the film Tootsie-the Dustin Hoffman movie where he dresses as a woman to get an acting job-his transformation is handled in not just a shot but ONE CUT. In one shot he’s Dustin and in the next he’s walking down the street as a woman.
In a book that would have been several pages detailing the transformation so that when he’s finally a woman it makes sense. In a film on e cut does the job.
Very different indeed.
Phil Brown
Sorry about the typos. I have vision problems and sometimes don’t see as well as I used to. But after my cataract operation at the end of the month things should improve.
Phil Brown
Good luck on that! Be sure if (as I assume) they implant lenses to talk to the doc about the desired focus range! On me mum’s, they assigned one without asking her.
Hope it goes very well indeed!
And interesting example. And a great transition.
In writing stories, you have to be clever in a different way: Say that at the end of the last chapter our hero Lance Sterling is trapped in a pit in a basement with poison gas, rising water, and poisonous snakes. The joke is, the next chapter starts: “With a mighty bound, Lance leapt from the pit and raced up the stairs.” —The old Saturday morning serials abounded with mighty bounds of one sort or another. Because we have to explain how Lance did it or be lynched, we have to ‘time’ the scene differently. But the desired effect is that painless switch.
I have seen transitions in which the transition went like this. “Chapter 13. Scotch splashed into the glass. Straight. Lance took it down at a gulp. “Damn,” said Lance. “I hate days like that…”
You’ll still get lynched, mind, deservedly. But it’s at least a better transition.
It sometimes bothers me that some of Ms. Cherryh’s works have gone out of print – despite favorable reviews and being very well written. I do recognize that many of the best sellers of the past have also suffered the same fate. How many Robert Louis Stevenson books are still in print. The popular ones are, but others are not – and some are extremely well written – he has one about his Father building a lighthouse – talk about scary. Who remembers Joseph C. Lincoln. Not that many Zane Grey’s are still in print. Popularity or good writing does not guarantee continued readership or book sales.
Ms. Cherryh has to earn her daily bread by her writing so writing that sells must come first. Also, as I have remarked before, since she does the work, she should call the tune.
Perhaps some of her works could be brought to Anime or Manga, but as she is an American writer, it is doubtful that any Japanese or Korean publishing house would show any real interest.
That’s it from the drenched Northeast.
I’d be interested in seeing what the people who did DeathNote would do with the kif… and I imagine they’d have a LOT of fun with The Dinner…
Ms. Cherryh and I contimue:
Good luck on that! Be sure if (as I assume) they implant lenses to talk to the doc about the desired focus range! On me mum’s, they assigned one without asking her.
Hope it goes very well indeed!
Me too! The kicker is that I only have vision on one eye-the one with the cataract. If it goes poorly it will be very bad indeed. But my vision is getting to the point where I really have little choice.
Phil Brown
I’m sure it will go well–this is an operation they have down very, very pat. The only thing I would caution—they will tell you post-op not to lift things heavier than a coffee cup for a certain period of time, and they will tell you NOT to bend over. They really, really mean this. The gist is—anything that could cause a pressure change in the eye can cause bleeding—and I personally would add plane flights and even car rides into the mountains as a no-no for the brief duration of that prohibition. It sounds silly, but find a convenient small shelf to put your shoes on so you don’t have to bend over to get them or put them on, or wear flipflops or mocs until you’re out of jail. 😉
I believer Robert Louis Stevenson’s books have reverted to the public domain. Unless there are high school English Lit or college English Lit classes making a demand for those books, I’m guessing that sales for RLS books are going to be slow.
CJ, correct me if I’m wrong, I thought copyright law ( and I’m NO expert) was good for 28 years and then could be renewed once for another 28 years. Perhaps it’s been updated to give you 56 years or more on the first go. If Zane Grey’s books were in print, conceivably his copyrights would still be active if the latter condition were the rule.
@philbrown, I had a cataract removed about 5 years ago, they improved the power with the implant so that instead of 20/200, I could see 20/40, better than with the dominant left eye with both eyes unaided.
Mr. 6nix writes:
CJ, correct me if I’m wrong, I thought copyright law ( and I’m NO expert) was good for 28 years and then could be renewed once for another 28 years. Perhaps it’s been updated to give you 56 years or more on the first go. If Zane Grey’s books were in print, conceivably his copyrights would still be active if the latter condition were the rule.
Thanks to the House Of The Mouse-Mickey, that is-copyright law is now very complicated with many now running life of the author plus some years. Disney basically bought the Congress and wrote the new laws in hopes of keeping Mickey protected when his copyright protection was about to expire.
BTW, this law was one of the reason for colorizing movies. Many movies were about to go PD and colorizing them started a new copyright.
As Mark Twain, no stranger to copyright wrangles himself, once wrote, “We have the best Congress money can buy.”
Phil Brown
Copyright is for the life of the author plus 50 years nowadays. Interesting, about the Mouse!
But in practicality, Project Gutenberg, which is one of the good guys, far as I can tell, does have some OP works that are technically still in copyright, but that don’t have any executor seeing to their continuance. They are sort of lying there in decline, and while I don’t favor what Google has tried to do—PG is doing a better job of selecting works that need preservation. It’s a fine line between following the law and letting a writer’s lifetime of work just piffle away into non-resurrection. I know something of the situation of some of these, where if the writer could yell at us from the hereafter, he’d say, “Get them in print, please!” Others (Edgar Rice Burroughs, eg) and many sf writers, have executors and agents for their ‘literary estate,’ and that long copyright period lets their heirs get something besides the honor of being related.
I believe (because of the Sonny Bono Act, i.e. the Mickey Mouse Protection Act, as it is otherwise known), it is now: life of author plus 70 years, and for corporate authorship, date of creation + 120 yrs, or date of publication + 95 years, whichever is earlier… and works published before 1978 were increased to 95 years from publication date…
Your government (after Congress getting donations of around $6.3 million in 1997/98)… protecting that dear little mouse from all of us! 😉
You miss the point – no matter what the copyright is, no matter how good a book is – it will not be in print if it does not sell. And the point is that Ms. Cherryh is a very good author. I am continually dismayed that some of her best work may be lost.
Which is why I’ve decided to take matters into my own hands. The people who crunch the numbers don’t *care* that most of the trucks headed out with copies of Cuckoo’s Egg were literally stalled in a snowdrift for the better part of a week. It missed the crucial ‘first week’ count at Barnes & Noble, etc, so it was a ‘slow seller.’ Pity any brand new writer making their debut that week.
Computers are a wonderful thing, but used as a blunt instrument, they cause a lot of trouble.
Argh! They were that stupid with a proven writer like you???
Grandal62 opines:
Argh! They were that stupid with a proven writer like you???
You clearly haven’t been to a chain bookstore lately.
They can’t tell a proven author from a hole in the ground.
Phil Brown
Yes – I have… buying books is my biggest addiction, and they always have CJ’s books there (but not the older ones). I don’t even buy there anymore though, I use the BookMobile app on my Droid, and scan the ISBN #, and keep a “books I want to buy” list. Then I go purchase from Fictionwise, B&N, Amazon, or Baen if it’s available in e- format already (I hate when they make you wait for a long time after the hardcover is out though).
I think they are not very good about new writers, but I would have thought they’d have done better for authors like CJ.
Don’t forget that at http://www.indiebound.org/indie-store-finder you can find independent booksellers that you may not have known about, near you. I found one in a very small town 10 miles away (our city, at least ten times larger, has none). I’m planning to ask them to order for me, next book-release time. Much better than supporting the huge faceless conglomerates.
Both fictionwise and amazon offered books of mine they had no right to sell, and never have paid me for what they sold before my publisher’s legal department made them remove the books—apparently they weren’t willing to pay up and regularize the situation, or whatever—I have no idea what actually went on in that conversation. All I know is they’d been selling my books for months and I got nothing. This is a publisher that is very good about paying me in a timely fashion, so I tend to blame the other end of the matter.
If that piracy by Fictionwise includes the first three Morgaine novels and the Ealdwood duology, I feel both embarrassed and furious to have been sucked in by thieves. Also rather guilty, but at least I can make it up by donating directly.
Not your fault, for sure. But I’ve never gotten a dime from Fictionwise.
I know this isn’t following the current line of thought, but as an aspiring writer-wanna-be, I thought I’d ask one of the best writers in the business, a question that has been bothering me for a while.
Do you build a new universe as you write a book or is there a process that you take to create the new background for such book? I mean, is there really any right way to go about it?
Build your characters first—though that doesn’t always happen: sometimes the nature of a universe is stronger in your mind, so it starts to form—but before it gets out of hand and untidy, create some characters. Just imagine a landscape or environment in the universe you sort of think you want, and disengage from this world and imagine someone walking toward you out of this universe: not too close yet. Keep your distance. But as this person gets closer, get a look at some general details, much as you’d analyze someone coming down a beach—how do they move, what do they wear, what’s their attitude. Let them get close enough for conversation and see if you can invite another character out of the distance. And then just stand there and let those two interact. You don’t so much ‘create’ characters as you ‘summon’ them, and then wait and see how they behave with each other. Invite them, one at a time or collectively, to tell you what they’re up to/here for or what they want, and how short a time they’ve got to get it. (Never let a character have too much time to solve a problem: turn up the heat.) And then just take notes. They’ll tell you about their universe.
Not everybody does it that way. But a notebook full of universe-design before you ever get to the characters and their problem is a good way to paint yourself into a corner—or as I’m wont to tell novice writers with a sagging plotline, “Hey, you drew the map. Move the castle closer. Give it an outpost. The bad guy sees them coming. That’ll build a fire under your characters.”
Universes, in short, aren’t sacrosanct and immutable. When the plot needs it, take a tuck. And keep things moving.
Well, if you’ve seen any of the Stargate Universe episodes, you might well appreciate what happened to my first attempt at a publishable work…
This book I was writing about 6 years back (the one I’m asking all these questions for), sort of died out with the rest of my projects. What happened is I was looking at a [literal] universe where the stereotypical FTL drive [AKA the TED or Tachyon Envelope Drive] was only usable outside a galaxy’s gravity well.
Anyway, extended universe short… I originally designed this universe to be roleplayed… the book ended up being more of an after-thought.
The thing that killed the book had nothing to do with ‘painting myself into a corner’, but the exact opposite. I created a universe that spanned two galaxies and had seven or more sentient races (including Terrans) that sort of clashed with each other in fun little ways. So, in effect, I gave myself too many ways of developing the set of characters I allowed myself.
You need a tempest in a teacup and just let a handful of good characters with something in common and another set with something at issue have access to it. Don’t use the whole universe at once. Just reference it. It can feel rich without feeling scattered, desperate, and over-explained.
That made me think about where I went wrong… and now I think I know where the book took a turn for the worst… I basically jumped into the middle of the book in the first chapter.
The original Prologue actually got wonderful reviews on one of the Play-by-Post sites, and I agree that the Prologue makes for a good starting point for the story. However, I think I realize now that I jumped too far ahead in time, to the point where the main protagonist confronts his parents’ killers…
Since I can’t edit my previous post… I’d like to add in… I have a board that has most of my universe data on it. As I see it, the universe I’ve built is big enough for probably 4+ full-time writers without ever really having issues with each others’ books.
Once I started writing a book for this universe, it changed the potential of the project, from being meant as merely another universe for people to roleplay in, to the next generation of Star Trek (pun not intended) or even Cyteen-style series’.
May I chime in to the current discussion?
Character, character, character. That’s what it all boils down to. Create characters that you-or your readers but you first-can believe in and identify with and 3/4ths of the battle is won..
Add a bit of conflict and you’re off to the races. I know it’s trite to say so but believable characters take on a life of their own and almost write the thing-book or script-for you.
Phil Brown
Absolutely. Universes are in one sense easy to create. Characters require a few pieces of your own soul in the mix.
Well, the universe I’ve been working on is meant to become sort of a character all of its own.
On a side note, are you familiar with an author by the name of Alastair Reynolds?
A bit like Charles Sheffield, seems as if. Don’t know him. But if that’s the nature of it, Charlie’s work is that way. Still, you have to pick a locale and a specific thing to happen.
That kind of universe is like a kaleidoscope, made up of small, apparently contradictory pieces: and mine are a bit that way politically—the villain of one piece may be the hero of another, as witness Mallory and Emory, who would appreciate each other, but who come from different sub-universes.
Ah, like Jin 12 in 40,000 in Gehenna?